Live Talk Ep. 29

How to Be a Good Communicator with Dave Edwards

This week on Live Talk, Dwayne welcomes pastor, speaker and author Dave Edwards to the show. Dave and Dwayne discuss tips on how to be a good communicator, Dave’s new book called Life Verse, and a new discipleship program by Dave Edwards.

LINKS:
Dave’s Website: www.DaveEdwardsSpeaks.com
Next Level Worship: www.nextlevelworship.com

Live Talk Ep. 29: How to Be a Good Communicator with Dave Edwards

Dwayne:

Hey everybody, welcome to Live Talk. I’m Dwayne Moore. Today, our special guest is Dave Edwards. Dave is a discipleship pastor. He’s an author. He’s also a speaker. He travels many parts of the United States speaking and I’ve known him for many years and he is one of the finest communicators that I know. I love his depth of information and experience and wisdom and knowledge of the Scriptures and he just loves the Lord. You’re going to see that emanate from the conversation I’ll have with him. So you’re going to hear about his latest book. You’re going to hear about tips for being a better communicator if you are a pastor or a Sunday school teacher or worship leader. You’re going to benefit from what this guy shares. You need to watch today. Don’t miss this episode of live talk. We’ll be right back with David Edwards.

Speaker:

You’re listening to Live Talk with Dwayne Moore. International conversations on worship.

Dwayne:

Hey, everybody. I know I’ll say this every time and you begin to wonder, but is can it always be this good? Yes, it can. It’s always good. And today, David Edwards is going to be incredible for you. I’m building him up and I promise you he’s going deliver. Dave, welcome to live talk.

Dave:

Thank you so much, Dwayne. It’s great to get to be on with you, man. It’s a real privilege.

Dwayne:

Well, I consider that as well now, so without giving a lot of history, nobody really wants to hear about, I do want to say that we have known each other a long time

Dave:

A long time. We are some of the last gospel troubadours left.

Dwayne:

Seriously, you’re still out there, man. I know you’re working in a local church, but you’re also still traveling and speaking.

Dave:

I’m still traveling all over the country and parts of the world. And it’s really all I’ve wanted to do since I was 16. That’s when I surrendered the call to ministry. And it just, it’s been I’ve been on a steady path of just walking through doors that God opens. You know, it’s been fantastic. I

Dwayne:

Can I just tell people that my first memory though, wasn’t that you were some deep theologian guy. Okay. But you came and did a student conference with us. It was like, don’t know for sure the date, but probably around 1990. That’s about when I started working for him. And with him and I was doing the music at his conferences leading to what we now call the worship time, but the praise music time. But and then there’s this guy named David Edwards, he’s talking about Dave. Super Dave going to be coming to speak. That’s right. Okay, okay, cool, man.I wasn’t in the circuit back in then. I was just kind of getting into it, you know? But anyway, I’ll say this guy, get up on the platform, and that’s you. And you start talking about I forget you had this whole thing down. It was like a comedy routine. It was amazing. And you would pull out little things and you say, read what’s on the bottle.

Dave:

People don’t get it.

Dwayne:

People don’t get it. That’s what it was – people don’t get it. And it was so good. Amazingly funny to me.

Dave:

I did that for a long time, like I built a whole sermon around this whole idea that people don’t get it. There’s things in life that people are clued out about, like, the last church I spoke at before I left the hotel. I said, hey, how do I get to this church? And the guy says to me, from here? I wanted to go no, from Oklahoma, I’ll go back and start over. Do you want to know the shortest way? I’m like, no, I’ve got time to kill. I’m sure they’ll wait. We just live in a world of people that don’t get it. They’re clued out.

Dwayne

I remember you pulled it out of your pocket. It was like a nose spray or something. It said, do not spray in your eye.

Dave:

Yeah, how about an aim do you have to be? Right? I was in Alabama. They had directions on how to use the washing machine at the hotel, and it said, do not add gasoline or explosives to your washing machine. I was like, that’s scary because that’s written because someone did it. Someone said you know, I think dynamite would make a great fabric softener, right? And that’s how all this happens. People do crazy stuff because they don’t get it and they have to write labels to cover their insurance, right? Make sure they’re safe.

Dwayne:

I was in tears back then. I’m in tears now. I love that. That’s my kind of humor, man. I still love that stuff.

Davev:

And then I built it all around how people can be clued out spiritually, you know?

Dwayne:

Right, right. You used this game to help people. You brought it back around. It was powerful. Yeah. It always had a point.

Dave:

Like the thing with my jokes was they always lived in a sermon and they always had a point. They always had a reason for being there. It wasn’t just, it wasn’t just being funny just for the sake of it.

Dwayne:

And you know, no, you never like that. We had you come back in to remember the singles conferences. I mean, here I will try to do singles conferences, and I was a single. It was the funniest thing. But I brought in cool people like you and it worked.

Dave:

I remember

Dwayne:

Yeah, man. We had some good times.

Dave:

Wow, man. I mean, those were good days, and the singles conferences, you know, there used to be a seminar out there where they teach you to make a list of your perfect mate. They always say, you know, make a list of the person you want to marry and, you know, as I traveled, I met people, had 300 things on their list. You know, like this is the person and, you know, but the reality is, is that time passes, the more stuff you mark off that list. And you get down to a point where your list consists of anyone is breathing with a day job, right? And that’s how it happens.

Dwayne:

That’s awesome. One of my funny memories with you is embarrassing to me. But looking back, it’s funny, but we did for a couple of years at the singles conference because, you know, we were just kind of looking for stuff they could do. We tried karaoke.

Dave:

Oh my goodness.

Dwayne

And I remember I had this guy screening him before they got up at the same, but he didn’t scream him too well. Because you and I are standing back at your booth at the back of the room and I’m letting them do their thing with their karaoke, you know? Everybody’s having a problem that I suddenly hear somebody saying, I got friends and low place.

Dave:

I do remember that.

Dwayne:

Here I’m talking to super Dave.

Dave:

Like, yeah, this is what we do at our conferences. We like to sing alcohol songs.

Dwayne:

I went up to the guy screening and I said, dude, why did you let him on that platform? Well, he said he liked that song. He said, I thought it was. How could you possibly think that’s okay?

Dave

Right? That is a hilarious use of discretion.

Dwayne

Oh, my goodness. I love that. Let me tell you what else I appreciate you about you, man, because we had you speak at our conference recently, at REFOCUS. And you didn’t try to be funny. You nailed it with things that I had people coming up after were saying, my whole view of worship has changed now. I mean, that’s what they say. And you were literally recorded. And you weren’t even in the room, but your presentation, David is very, very powerful, and you’re and you have a lot of meat in what you say. So I don’t want to give anybody the impression that it’s just the fluff. Oh, no, no, no. No, you got a lot of depth about you. And I love that you’ve kept that over the years. You’ve never lost that. In fact, you’ve gone deeper. It seems to me.

Dave

Thank you. I appreciate it. Because I made an effort to do just that, you know, like I said, like for me, when I started, I was, I was trying to replicate the way people listened when they watched TV or they watched YouTube, there’s a show and a commercial and I was trying to replicate people’s attention span. So I’m still an exegetical guy. I still exegete the text, but I built it, you know, I framed it around humorous situations. And that was the idea, especially with students was to do something that would engage them and then tee the word up, right? And so that’s what I’ve tried to do. And it’s increasingly more dangerous to be funny in our culture. Which has just pushed me to the deeper end of the content of the word. So that’s what I’m doing. So when I teach now, it might be, it might be a little funny, but I’m really getting into the meat of the text and pulling out, I think you have to find something in a text that resonates with the heart of every human being. Like if you address a need that everyone feels like fear, frustration, or being feeling like you’re everyone gets something that you don’t, you know, that that’s the stuff that all of a sudden you connect to the heart and the scripture being living  and active goes right into that area. You know, and so that was the strategy for me.

Dwayne

And I do appreciate that about you too, that you understand which, you know, it’s a truth, but as you just pointed out, some people don’t seem to get it, even some of us as leaders, the word of God is living and active. And you don’t have to you don’t have to help him out. I mean, just make it clear. What you do that very well.

Dave

And that’s what I try to do, and I think we all kind of toss that thing that verse around about it being living in active. But to mean that it’s living means that it comes up off the page, right? It comes up off the page and as I continue to read scripture for as many decades as I’ve been a believer, you know, it’s to the point now where I can’t get it to stop screaming, right? I mean, every time I read it, I see something. That’s the living part. The metaphors and the stories all come alive with spiritual meaning, you know? And that’s the living. That’s the living part. The active part is that when you put that inside of you, like I always say, you know, when you, anytime a text uses a metaphor, that’s the key to unlocking the whole story, right? And that’s the active part, is that that thing becomes activated within our soul. So that’s how that, to me, that’s how that works.

Dwayne

I’ve never thought of it like that, but I agree with you. Yeah.

Dave

So when Paul’s is where to put on Christ, that metaphor of putting on something, right? That Jesus becomes our second skin that we operate in, right? When you start to really drill down that text, that metaphor unlocks everything else that he’s talking about. We put on Jesus. And it’s tailored within our disposition, right? The same way a garment works is the same way the spiritual life works, right? This jacket has no life in it until I put it on today. It just hung in the closet. And when I put it on, it’s becomes animated. The spirit of God takes over our disposition and manifests himself through it. To me, that’s the active part, right? The text gets into our soul and changes the way we think about wearing Christ.

Dwayne

Wow, that’s powerful stuff. That’s powerful, yeah. Well, it was a Jeremiah that said his word was shut up in my bones or something like that.

Dave

Yes, you set up in my bone like a fire, shut up in my bones.

Dwayne

Yeah, and so where’s the fire with so many of us now? I feel like we don’t have that, but the word of God is still fire. But I’m not sure it’s shut up in our bones sometimes.

Dave

I know. I think we’ve been a long season of people that want to be academic with the word and they dismissed creativity and insight and letting the text come alive. I’ve heard a lot of guys well, I’m just going to teach the word and the people have to sort it out. But not even Jesus did that. Jesus, you’d seeds and soil and told stories and engaged all the senses and so I think that we’ve been in a long season of that kind of that kind of preaching where there’s no heat on it. And for me, I’ve gone the other direction, like I’m still I’m still content driven, but I want the text to be living and active in the lives of the listener, right? In other words, we’ve asked theology to do something that’s not prepared to do, right? We’ve said, we’ve asked theology to make us deeper. And that’s not what it’s designed to do. Theology is a scaffolding that in which we put how we live faith. But theology doesn’t make this deeper. Interacting with the text makes this deeper. You know what I’m saying? So we’ve asked we’ve asked this theology was originally created to give structure and form an ecclesiology to the church, so we know what we believe and why we believe it, all those things. We need it, right? The structure that everything fits into, but the depth, this created an application, right? The depth of faith is created when we let that word become living and active and penetrate our lives. And so I just, you know, I just think they’re especially with what’s happening in our globe with just all the issues. I think people want to, they don’t just want to have an event. They want to have an encounter with the lord. I don’t just teach to my mind. Teach to my heart and my soul.

Dwayne

I don’t, I’m not sure, because I’ve read several preaching books, but I feel like it was the Tim Keller book, but anyway, there was a book that I read not too long ago that was talking about that very thing. That it’s not sufficient as a preacher, just to preach it, but you want to pray that a communication happens with the listeners. So what do you think? I mean, I think you’ve already expressed it not to ask you to say it all over again, but I mean, we do have a responsibility as a presenter of the gospel to help them. Ultimately, all the spirit does it, but we need to be clear in our communication. I mean, use analogies and things to help them.

Dave

Yeah, I mean, clarity is king, right? Clarity is king, like the first rule of everything is to be extremely clear, and then to be creative with it. I think a lot of, you know, you’ve got two extremes. You have people that are academic without any application. Then you have people that are extremely creative without any clarity. And they do elaborate jumping motorcycles over the stage and driving cars on all this creative stuff and people are like, I’m not exactly sure what that means. What does that mean about Jesus, you know? But the first rule is to always, if you can be clear and know what you’re saying, then you can be creative, right? Then that’s where the stories and the applications and building an illustration that comes out of the text, like I never, I never stray too far, you know, some guys are famous for reading a verse and then telling a ton of stories that are all unrelated. But for me, I feel like everything that we talk about has to be tethered to the text, tethered to what we’re saying. So I will never stray too far from everything I do has always attached to the text itself. So we go out and illustrate it, we come back to it. We read it and go out and illustrate it, come back to it and read it. So that’s just a simple art of being clear in our communication.

Dwayne

Well, I know that we want to get to talking about your book. I’m very excited about your discipleship program, some things you want to tell us about. Just a few moments on this, I’m real interested. For the listeners out there, watchers, if you’re listening to my podcast or watching it on television, either way, the guy we have with us today, in my opinion, and you need to know I’ve worked with a thousand or more pastors and conferences and things. I’ve been around a long time. And I believe that Dave is one of the most effective communicators out there. So you need to listen to the guy has to say in my opinion now. And so with that in mind, would you take a moment to tell us how do you build one of these messages? Now, as an evangelist You get the opportunity to repeat it a few times and people say oh you’ve had lots of practice. Yeah, but there was a first time he did it.

Dave

That’s right.

Dwayne

So when you did first, how do you start and build this? I’d love to hear how you

Dave

That’s a great question. And currently I’m doing I’ve been doing a campus Bible study at Louisiana Christian university. Every week. So I’ve been I’m still in the process of writing new things every week, you know? So I’ve been for instance, I just finished teaching through Colossians and did 24 weeks out of college. There’s only there’s only 95 verses in the book. Okay. I did 24 sermons out of four chapters of Colossians. And so, you know, I’ve been in that grind and then when we were working together, I was doing citywide Bible studies for young adults. You know, riding 42 talks a year for decades at a time. And so I’ve always been in process of trying to be better and trying to understand it and be clear. And so this whole journey through Colossians for me has been just that is that, for instance, like Colossians, one opens with Jesus talking with Paul talking about the Jesus was before all things and in him all things were created. I mean, it’s high Christology. It’s high Christology. It’s incredible. He’s talking about the exaltation of Christ, so he sees Jesus, not just resurrected, right? Not just living beyond the cross, but now ascended to be seated at the right hand of God. I mean, think about the vision of that and how lofty that is. And so my question is, what do you do with that with college students? I could speak for hours on the Christology of Jesus. Those few verses are dense with content. You know, but so what I did was I talked about the reason why I have a why the act of exalting Christ is so important is that that’s how we scale our life, right? We scale our life to the supremacy of Jesus. We don’t scale our life to circumstances. We don’t scale our life to our failures, our past. And so what I did was, what I do with the text, you take a text and you find a simple principle. That makes that puts it on the bottom shelf for people, right? So we could talk all day long about exalting Jesus and the power of exaltation and the principle of exaltation. But for a college student that’s like, man, I’m just trying to get through classes. I’m trying to find the love of my life. You know, what am I ,I get it, one of my supposed to do that. So I just banged away at the simple idea is that we scale our life to the supremacy. In other words, we have our problems and our conflicts and the things that the way life presses down upon us, but we look at those things through the supremacy of Jesus. And we begin to see Jesus is bigger than the things that are pressing in upon us, right? So it’s this simple idea of scaling our life according to the supremacy of Jesus. So it opened my mind. Like I said, it became living and active. And I got to where I was driving through the city, and I couldn’t look at anything in my life without thinking about it in relation to the Jesus in its exalted place. Wow. Does that make sense? You see what I’m saying? So we scale our life down here according to the supremacy of Jesus up there. And so when you start to see your problems through the supremacy of Jesus, your problems, instead of looking bigger than everything else, you can see them in the right way. You can see them in the right perspective and the right dimension. So once I found that then what I do is I’m still a point guy, all right? So I look through those verses and I spend I always try to make friends with the text. So like I spend probably 20 hours a week working on a sermon. It’s an event. But a lot of it is me just getting to know the text, just reading it and looking at it and becoming what I call becoming friends with the text. And as I do, I start to see a pattern or some points that come up out of it. So I know I’m going to talk about scaling my life to according to the supremacy of Jesus. And then what does this text then teach me about how to do that? Yeah. Right. In him all things as he was before all things. And all things came into being and by him, all things are held together. What does that tell me? How does that instruct me in order to what is the active part of that word that helps me to scale my life according to Jesus. And then once I, once I have those points, I start to see that pattern in the text, then I always do three things. And so for anybody who’s a Bible study leader or pastor or anyone who speaks and communicates, especially in terms of the word of God, there’s three things you always have to do. You always have to explain the text in light of the point that you’re making. You always have to you have to apply it, right? The application part is addressing the pushback that people have in their minds, even though you’re the only one speaking, you’re still having a conversation with people saying, yeah, but that’s different for me and you don’t understand my circumstances. So there’s what I call the invisible giants in the room, right? The invisible giants have pushed back and the way people try to excuse themselves from the demands of the text makes them, you know, and so you always have to explain the text in light of the point you’re making, you have to apply it. By thinking about what people are thinking when they hear it. And then you find a way to illustrate it. A way to make it memorable. Whether it’s a story about yourself or like for me, when I was reading those labels and all those ridiculous things that seemed outlandish, but they were all tethered to a point in the text. So that’s, I mean, that’s kind of the simple that’s the short version of what I do every week. So I’m constantly in the, in the fight, I would say that writing sermons like wrestling a Tiger. You’re taking these words that are thousands of years old and saying, okay, what does this have to say to us today? And then trying to make it amplified in the life of the year, right? So that’s kind of the short version. That’s what I did. And every single, you know, every time I try to make friends with the text, I do what I call EAI – Explained,  Apply,  Illustrate. I explain apply illustrate, right? So those are the three, that’s the three rhythm. So if you just have one point in the sunny school lesson, then you should always do those three things. And for every point you have, you always do those three things. You explain the text, you apply it, and you illustrate it. And so if you listen to me, it sounds fluid and it sounds conversational and people are like, oh, it seems like it just flows out of him. But it’s all very, you know, it all is very deliberate. Like I’m doing those three things. If you go back and listen to even what I did at refocus, I did those three things for every point that I had. I explained Isaiah, I applied it. I illustrated.

Dwayne

It was very, very powerful. Yeah. And it was simple to understand though.

Dave

Yeah. Right? And so that’s what I’m talking about. That’s the art of clarity, right? That’s the art of like we’re trying to make it to where people like I still use points because I want if people write down points, I want them to be able to say, oh, I can do that. My points always have verbs on them, you know, and like that talk out of Isaiah was confrontation of the spirit confession of self. When you write those down, look at you’re like, oh, I can do that. I got things in my life. I need confess. I got things that need to be cleansed within me. And so I wrote a piece a long time ago called what you don’t know can’t hurt you 21 rules of communication. We might save that for another show one day or another seminar, but it’s the 21 things that if you don’t know these things, they hurt you in the act of communicating the word of God to people. And it’s a great little seminar, it I designed to help people think about the blind spots in their communication.

Dwayne

Yeah, man. Yeah. Well, one thing. I want everybody to pick up all and I want to highlight he’s talked about being friends and making friends with the passage. I think of it in a little different way, but it ultimately and lands the same place. When I hear someone teach like you, Dave, and others like you, I always get the sense that you know a lot more about this than you’re telling me right now. As far as there’s this, I mean, you know, I feel like there’s a well underneath this, a deep well. But I appreciate you not this fire hydrant, you know, like a fire hydrant, giving it all in once. You boil it down. If you think about the analogy of boiling it down, the person boiling has the whole thing and then they boil it. So you got a big picture and then you manage to simplify it for, and that takes TIME. He said, well, that’s right. So you just got to make time, right?

Dave

You got to make time. You got to make time for it, and one of my principles in that article I did was, you know, the art of speaking is knowing what not to say. Right? It’s knowing what to leave out. I always know way more like I know way more about Colossians than I’ve been able to teach in 24 weeks because I’ve just picked it up along the way. But I don’t have to say everything that I know all the time. It’s not an intelligent contest, right? We’re trying to get people to ingest and metabolize the word within them. And so the real art of somebody, anybody who’s someone who loves to teach, will always have faced the temptation of over teaching. They want to teach everything they’ve read and everything they know that for sure. Right. And part of the preparation process is you have to go back through and relentlessly edit right and take out stuff and go if it may be good, but if it didn’t help me make my point, it’s got to go. And like live events, like when we were like what we’re all getting back to, you know, with live events, everything that comes before the speaker, it comes out of the speaker’s time, right? If the band goes long, if the skits go long, you know, if the testimonies go long, then someone will say, hey, we know you had 40 minutes, but you’re now down to 30. Yeah. And so they’re on the spot. I have to be able to edit, right? I’m not going to be able to say everything I have to be able to even look at it at that point. When the clock is about to be on and go, okay, I’m not going to do this, I’m not going to do that. I’m going to leave the so. And usually the titer, a talk becomes the better it is, right? It’s not more spiritual. It takes less preparation to speak for 55 minutes than it does for 5 minutes. That is a anybody can go on for 55 minutes and talk about nothing. But to do it in 5 or 15 and to get your point across, that’s where the art of it is. I

Dwayne

This happened three or four years ago now. I was invited out to California baptist university to speak. And they flew me out there, put me in hotel and all that. And what he told me though, he said, the worship director of the school he said, I want you to come and speak for 20 minutes. He said, less than 20 minutes, even it would be good. He had 20 minutes. Yes. And so it made me really have to do what you’re talking about. I had to really hone that thing. So I can appreciate what you’re saying.

Dave

in so many ways, it makes the talk so much better. I spoke at Trinity western university, I think it was up in Canada. And I did their spiritual emphasis week. So I was there all week long. I did their chapel, you know? And the guy that ran it said, okay, every morning, you have 24 minutes. If you go 25, they’re all going to get up and leave because class starts. He said, it’s not personal. They just got to go. I got to go. So when I got up in front of me was a giant green digital clock that started at 24 and counted down, right? It didn’t matter. It didn’t matter how many I thought I was or how deep the sermon was. And I knew I had to be done in 24 minutes, right? So that’s the stuff that makes people great communicators is that when you have to preach under those confines of those kind of limitations, you learn what you’re not speaking in sound bites, it’s not that short, but you learn how the art of communication is always brevity. It’s always about how can I be succinct. The idea, we scale according to supremacy. Well, I mean, I could take 40 minutes and talk about that, or I could just say, we scale our life according to supremacy. Right? You see what I’m saying? You’re taking something that is, you know, you could do a lot in trying to get it down into its most concise, cohesive. This is what ad agency should do. They create taglines to help people remember their products. This is essentially what we’re trying to work as a communicators. We’re creating principles that help people remember what the text was about. Right. So the principle is a short succinct statement, you know, that there’s always anchored to a text.

Dwayne

And Dave, I think one thing that helped me heard Scott talk about it first when I started traveling with Scott Dawson, he and I traveled together for years, as you know. But he told me back then, years ago, he said, he said, some of the people, I think Jay Strach and some others that were at the time were mentoring. Said, we script, he said, I’ll script a message and I said, do you script them, man? And not to say that everybody has to do that. That’s not the point. Right. The point is, he said, but then I would edit and I would make sure I’m saying what I really need to say. And that seemed foreign to me because I didn’t grow up in an environment that had value in that. But I could see the value and being around guys like you and Jay and Scott and other people. You clearly have a honed it. And it’s obvious.

Dave

Yeah. Everyone has their own methods. Some guys manuscript because they want to have, they want to pick every word and have every one be right.

Dwayne

That seems a little extreme, but hey, if that works for you, right?

Dave

Yeah, I mean, that would add another 20 hours of I had to type everything out word for word.

Dwayne

I’m kind of making a segue here though because I want to talk about writing books and not in general, but to your book that you wrote, but I’m going to start some of your material in the past and it’s very, very powerful. I haven’t read the one you’re about to talk about, but I love your writing style. And I asked I remember standing in front of, it was in Pigeon Forge, Tennessee, which is what we call the smokies for those of you. Yes, that’s right. The country is you don’t know where that is, but it’s a vacation holiday spot. And you and I were talking in the lobby of a nice theater. Where we were both doing a conference and I remember asking, Dave I’m thinking about writing a book, you got any advice for me. And you told me, it’s just going to take you a ton of time per lesson. You’re going to take a time. And so I remember that. So I’ve always respected your approach to writing and I’m excited, frankly, to hear about your newest creation.

Dave

Hey, well, that’s great. I mean, the writing, I was a speaker who became a writer. And the writing is sweet thing for me because, you know, when I was in school, I was diagnosed with dyslexia and told I’d never graduate from school, never go to college because I couldn’t read and I couldn’t keep up with the class. And so my three greatest fears growing up were reading in public, speaking in public and writing. So I spent the last 25 years doing the three things I fear the most. I’ve written 30 books since we’ve known each other. I think this is somewhere, this is one of the recent ones. And so I created this book called Life Verse. Life Verse: Discovering the Power of Scripture and Story. It’s kind of a bit of what we’re talking about in terms of letting the text become living and active, but the premise of this book is that I believe every person ought to have a life verse. So for instance, when I was diagnosed with dyslexia, I was in 6th grade and I was a churchgoer and I got saved and I was 9 and but I knew enough to know that I needed a promise. I needed a promise to get through that season of my life because I had a lot of fear about taking tests. Someone called me in public, I’d break out into a sweat. I mean, I had a lot of just a lot of anxiety that went with that, plus my home life was disintegrating and so I didn’t know a lot about the Bible because I was so young, but I knew enough to I knew I needed a promise. I needed something, you know? And I found this verse out of Deuteronomy 23:5, that says, God turns the curse into a blessing to demonstrate his love for us. It was about saying that, you know, balaam’s trying to curseIsrael and there’s a lot of words background goes to all that. And in the midst of all like Malan has been hired to curse Israel and come against them and in the middle of that, you know, Moses says that God turns the curses of our life into a blessing to demonstrate his love for us. So good. And I found that verse when I was in 7th grade and I’ve done life with it since that moment. And so I would say the one I would talk, I would mention this kind of stuff and people will go, well, how do you find a life first? And so I thought, I’m going to write a book about it. It seemed obvious to me. But so I wrote a book on how to find your life first.

And so in the book, I say that, yeah, so in the book, I say that having a life verse is different than having a promise. There are God gives us promises for specific situations in our life, right? There’s promise, you know, when God gives us promises in times of financial stress or in times of marital stress, but a life verse functions as an umbrella. In other words, it becomes the Canopy of our life, it becomes the lens through which we view everything else. So every time something look like it was going to work against me, I looked at it through the lens of Deuteronomy 23:5. That God takes the curses of my life and turns them into a blessing for no other reason than to demonstrate his love for me. Yeah. So all of a sudden, the problems, when you look at them through the prism of a life verse they look differently and then one of the things I can tint from the book is that if you take a God gives you a verse and you do the life with that verse, it becomes exponentially richer as the decades pass, right? So this is not the same as having a box of promises written on cards and all that’s one thing or having a book a promise that you go through a life verse is something as a verse that God gives you that we do life with, right? It’s the lens through which we look. It’s the umbrella under which we live. And so the book is about the process of doing that. So it’s a little bit kind of what we talked about in terms of preparing discernment, but it’s what I call the pop of the page. In other words, like you begin reading and the spirit of God takes a verse and it pops in your soul. It comes up off the page. It becomes a personal word, right? Some people call that a rema word. Some people call that. But I tried to eliminate that language because I wanted people to not get caught up in, I don’t want that word to be a trigger word. So I called it the pop of the page. It’s the moment the verse becomes personal. I know that I know Deuteronomy 23 5 is about Ballam in Israel. But when I found it, it was like, God, you know, it was like, God took that verse over and above the page and put it right into my heart. You know? And so the book is about how you do that.

Dwayne

How to locate that and how to locate that verse.

Dave

So then what I did was I in the book, I talk about that when you think about the classic divisions of the way scriptures divide, right? The history books and the prophetic books and the poetry books and the New Testament. The gospels, you know, the classic the way it’s divided. That it really, those divisions all have a common, they all each have a common theme. So the first 5 books has a theme, right? The minor prophets has a theme, the gospels have a theme. The epistles have a theme. And so what I do in the book is I teach someone to figure out what the theme of their life is. And then to go to take that theme and to know what part of the Bible to go to, and then you start to read, you read systematically, right? You start at the front of that section of books and you just read until God speaks to you. Okay. Read until something pops off the page. So we’re not just indiscriminately pulling a verse out and go, well, I love Jeremiah 29 11, right? \

Dwayne

If you read that in context you might not like that as much.

Dave

And so the life versus something that’s discovered in the process of deliberate systematic reading. So for instance, what I did was I developed a graph in here, maybe I can find it maybe but I can’t. I developed a graph where we talked about the divisions of scripture and then the theme that each of those divisions are about. And then when you say, well, you’re my theme is the theme of my life is whatever it is. Then you go to that block of books of scripture and that’s where you begin.

Dwayne

So I love that. Yeah. Right.

Dave

So I just tried to put together something that was simple. And then I answer in the book, you know, what a life verse is, what it isn’t. We need to talk about that’s why we call had a life first just to live by faith. Jesus had a life first. You think about David had a life first? Every person in the scripture that did something great. Moses had a life verse. There was always a moment where these guys were given an establishing word. They were giving they were given a verse that established everything else that followed after that.

Dwayne

Obviously, I’m sure I’m not the only one watching and listening thinking the same thing, but I’m going, what’s mine? Yes, right?

Dave

So that’s why I wrote the book was to meet that need. That’s right. Yeah. And so there’s a chapter here called the birth of the life verse and I talk about Mary, right? Where the spirit of God appears to her and what does he do? He speaks scripture over her. Before she gives birth to Jesus, she has given a verse by which that’s going to happen. And that’s what she holds onto. And when you fast forward to the first miracle at Canaan, and she says, whatever he tells you to do, do it. All of that was predicated on her life verse. David had a life verse Paul had a lifw verse. They all had these people all had something in which their life and their thoughts. It’s a powerful, powerful concept.

Dwayne

I’m resonating with you. You know, I’m just I’m debating in my mind about which one it boiled down to for me and either be Isaiah 40 one because I got tired a lot back then and still do sometimes. But I think that’s good. Yeah, well, but the other one I think for me and probably the one I would land on if I went to your book, I would note, but probably Proverbs 3:5. which is I know it’s I know that’s a vacation bible school verse, not for me, buddy. That wasn’t a Sunday school. That was a real. That was the real question. So all kinds of depth in my life. And so hey, man. And I’m loving it. I’m loving what you’re saying. Anybody to figure that out. That’s powerful.

Dave

Yeah, and you can order it off my website. That’s what I was going to ask you. It’s available. On my website is DaveEdwardsspeaks.com. Cool. And then I also have, I’m a part of a compilation of devotional that comes out once a year. That’s on there as well. Nice. Okay. But I challenge this book is a worthy read because it will teach you how to read the text and there’s a chapter in there called the way of the ear, which is based on proverbs too, where he says incline your ear to my wisdom. It’s learning how to listen to the text. This is kind of what we talked about at the top of the show was moving beyond just reading the text transactionally and reading the text and academic way. But to begin to tune our ear to this, I think we always have to read scripture in the spirit in which it is written. It’s written in a redemptive spirit. Even the judgmental parts of scripture are written from a spirit of redemption and God going after his people to bring them back. And the way of the ears I talk about how you tune your ear to the how you lean into scripture and tune your ear to the text.

Dwayne

Well, it’s interesting you say this, you know, little confession moment here, but everybody needs a good accountability. And I live in the world of the Bible teaching it, now I do that for a living and yet I become busy a lot lately to the point where I’m just kind of running on the fumes of what I learned last month or whatever. And it’s like, no, no, no, no, no. And so I told my wife and I emailed my friend an accountability partner and I said, look, I need to get back to being a student in the mornings where I’m listening instead of sitting on my couch and just, you know, I’ll sit down and have a really comfortable chair in my office and I’ll sit there and I read a bit of a call it my quiet time. And it is. I’m not saying it’s not. But I’m not really becoming a student. You’re speaking of. And the verse that came to my mind, I just quoted it to my wife this morning. I said, I think I’m going to start sitting downstairs at a kitchen table that’s not comfortable, but it’s going to cause me to be awake, and I’m going to focus in some journaling, because that wakes me up. I’m going to come back to me in a student. That’s what I did in school, man. Didn’t like it, but that’s how I learned. And the versa that came my mind and I quoted her Isaiah 50:4. Part of which says he awakens me morning my morning wake awakens my ear to listen like one being taught. Isn’t that the idea though, to be a student. That is the idea. You got to get you. You know, it’s Mark Lowry that used to say I guess he still does knowing him. I spent a lot of time in the work. He said, I named my bed the word, and I spent a lot of time there. Spent a lot of time, that’s right. But you got to get out of the word. You got to get out of there. Yeah, you got to get in the way.

Dave

Well, there’s probably a lot of people listening that feel exactly like, I don’t read as much as I should. They beat themselves up. And so let me see if I can set you free with and your listeners free with a piece of brevity like in terms of when we were talking about being succinct, that when it comes to reading scripture, we’re not changed by how much we read. We’re only changed by what we retain.

Dwayne

Boom, that’s it, right?

Dave

So when I talked about being in front of the text, I’m not reading tons of scripture every week. I’m reading three or four verses out of Colossians every day, and I’m spending hours and days at a time with it. So I’m not changed by reading 15 different places at a scripture and jumping all around. I’m only changed by what I retain, right? That whole thing about Colossians 1, I didn’t look at that before we talked. But I didn’t know you were going to ask me about that. But I’ve spent enough time with it. Yeah. So we’re not changed by how much we read. We’re changed by what we retained.

Dwayne

Don’t you think that’s what the psalmist meant when he said your word is hidden in my heart?

Dave

That’s right. And when you push that application, I’ve metabolized it, right? I’ve ingested it. I’ve metabolized it. It’s the word has become flesh within me. It’s something that I draw from and live out of and so I would rather see people, you know, spend a little each day reading the same verse until it just becomes well and grafted into your soul.

Dwayne

I am living in that right now. That’s what I’m experienced going to the book of Romans. I love journaling through books in the Bible. And Romans, bro, I gotta be honest. It’s not so easy for me to get.

Dave

That’s tough, man. It’s a tough read.

Dwayne

Powerful theology, and I’m not, I mean, I’m not known as the theologian guy. But I don’t let myself off the hook. I want to get this as much as I can. I can’t read it. I’ll read a portion for chapter three, four days are now read commentaries and I’ll pray and I’ll just soak on it every day. And that’s what I’m having to do to get some of this.

Dave

So for instance, let me, this is a good thing for you to know. When we talked about EAI and I in scripture explained apply illustrate Paul is doing application. In other words, like in Romans, he’s having a conversation with a citizen of Rome that doesn’t know anything about the buoyancy of Christianity. And so that’s why it’s not written to western mindset. He’s having a dialog while he’s in prison, he’s he’s imagining what a Roman citizen would ask and say about Christianity and he’s responding. He’s just not telling you which one he’s doing at any given moment. So you have to, you know, one of the things that helps to read Romans is I always say you have to read within the commas, right? So if you look at a chapter at a Romans and you read the words inside the commas, then you start to see the flow of the text, right? You start to see the message of it and not get caught up in the weeds, right? So he’s having a conversation with somebody who doesn’t know anything about Christianity, but he’s not telling you, okay, now I’m switching over to this person. But that’s the rhythm of the text. He’s going back and forth with that. So that’s just a fun fact for you to remember. As you read Romans.

Dwayne

I’ve finally got over the Romans 12 and now I’m 13 and so this is a more practical application, which I like. Yes, that’s right. It’s a little bit I can get this a little bit easier, but boy 7, 8, 9. And all that, it’s like, and the sin, and so rich. So rich. So applicable once you get it.

Dwayne

Well, hey, tell us about your discipleship program. Okay. You’re working on.

Dave

This is what this is probably like I’m passionate about everything we’ve talked about today and I’ve speak on this to churches. Preaching conferences and my first conferences, but I’m really passionate about what’s happening in terms of discipleship. And I’ve been at a church in Houston as their pastor of discipleship. And so it put me on a journey of trying to figure out what do we mean by this, right? Like when I got there, I called other people that had the same position that I had. And people had different definitions of so some people I learned used discipleship as an adjective, right? When they say, we’re going to do when they say we’re going to, we’re going to go overseas and play soccer and paint a building. They call that discipleship Or when they say, oh, those Sunday school is to sample ship. Or reading a book is to stop a ship or like the meaning of they used it as nouns and adjectives and, you know, when I look at a scripture, Jesus used to establish it as a verb. Right. The call to make disciples is bookended, it bookends his ministry, opens by calling people to follow him. He closes by calling people to go and make disciples. And both of those cases, they’re verbs. Follow me and I’ll make you become fishers of men. Go and make disciples of all nations, right? Everything in between that Jesus ministry is bracketed by using discipleship as a verb, something that we do. For Paul, it was, it wasn’t, it wasn’t a course or a class. Or a curriculum, which is what I think it’s become in our world. When someone says it’s opposite, they were like, oh, here’s a curriculum, right? Here, here’s my book. You read my book, you know? And you don’t ever, even as much as Paul wrote, Paul never said, hey, you should read my new book called Romans.

Dwayne

Actually, you’re right. I got it right. He didn’t do that. That’s true.

Dave

Or he didn’t do that, right? But you know what I discovered was that everything in terms like you can remember the church didn’t have a Bible until 40 years almost 40 years after the resurrection. Yeah, that’s easy. Through letters and things floating about Galatians, Ephesians,  Philippians Colossians were being read circularly in towns, but not everybody had access to that. And yet, and yet Paul Christianized his Rome and four centuries without a Bible. I think about that. He christianized his Rome, all of Rome becomes here’s the gospel of four centuries without a course without a curriculum without a class, right? And so, and the statement is made of Jesus disciples and acts where it says, and the men who turned the world upside down have come here also. Also, these guys did they didn’t have a Bible yet. They were Mark was writing it, right? Mark was writing the gospels. But yet they christianized talent, some area experienced great survival without a book. So if this started to push at the boundaries of my cultural Christianity, you know, I pushed the boundaries and what I discovered was what was happening was that the gospel and the life of Jesus was being spread conversationally. Yes. What was happening in the first century was the disciples that were still alive, were sitting around tables in people’s houses and they were telling stories about Jesus and what it was like to travel with him and what it was like when they saw him feed the 5000 or walk on the water. They would tell these stories. And those stories would get retold. People would lead those rooms and they’d go tell those stories about this man named Jesus. And those stories would get repeated to somebody else, and people steadily and systematically begin to believe in the ministry of Jesus because of the conversations people were having. Okay. So this started, like I said, I’ve written 30 books in my lifetime. I mean, I love books. Obviously, I’ve sold a lot of books in my lifetime. I’m for it. But what was happening in the first century in the second century was that they were christianizing towns and people without systematic Bible studies. They were doing it through the art of conversation. They were harnessing the power of the friendships they had with people and they were having to stop the ship conversations and then what happened. Those stories got told and they got retold and they got retold. And then somewhere along the way, people begin to write them down. They became the gospels. They eventually were canonized. There is a progression to how the word became the word how the Bible, how the word became scripture, right? But before that, it was all happening conversationally. So what happens to me in Houston was I started to think, well, I was discipling 7 guys a week and I started to try to be intentional with my conversations. I wasn’t just like, hey, did you see the game? You staying pure and just kind of all those things that you can kind of lie your way through. I started to try to intentionally have discipleship conversations. So when I paid attention, this may be too nerdy for your audience, but you just gotta let me do it. When I paid attention to when I was having a discipleship conversation, every discipleship[ conversation had the same elements. Okay. Right. They all had a point. They all had a principle that a lot of picture. They all had a progression. They all had a way to practice it. They all had the same every establishment conversation had the same elements. There was always a passage always pointed always a principle. Always a picture and always a way to practice it. All right. Okay. That finishes our nerd part of discipleship. And but what I try to do, I must be as nerdy. It’s probably more than people want to know, right? Because it’s easier for people to just go, well, can we just have a Bible study? Oh, I understand what you’re saying. Can we just read a book together? All right, do I need to know all this? And so what I try to do is I try to intentionally do those 5 things. Built it into, yeah. I built it in. I didn’t say to the guys I was okay, this is our passage. This is our principal for today. And I didn’t have an order. I just tried to be when a topic came up. I had a passage, I’ve tried to formulate it into a simple principle. There was always a picture a way to illustrate it whether I thought about it out of scripture or something happened in the moment. There was a way to put it into practice. I would challenge them and say, this week, let’s put this into plus try doing this, you know? And I started what I started to see was that the word started to stick in the lives of these guys.

In a way that didn’t happen if we just sit together and did a workbook or filled in blanks and I’m not saying that’s wrong. I’m just saying that when you talk about discipleship, discipleship always implies replication, right? Jesus says, go and make disciples, right? Not go and make disciples that implies replication. So something happened that there was a replication that happened in X two or 3000 people or editors or replication that happened in the city of Rome and Paul is sending people out by twos and they’re going out and having a conversation that people disciples are being made, right? And so what began to happen was that, as I started to have these conversations with these guys, and I began to see the way that the word was sticking in the lives of these dudes, and then I would ask the question, who do you know that you could have the same conversation with? Because that’s what was happening in the New Testament. Who do you know that you could have this and they would go, well, such and such probably Easter, I was like, okay, so this week, I want you to have this conversation what we just talked about. I want you to do it with whoever. And then I want you to tell me how it went. Right? So now, there’s a replication in, right? The conversation we’re having are going to have with somebody else. Yeah. And in discipleship, you only have to be one step ahead of the person you’re disciplined. You don’t have to be months or years ahead. You only have to be one step ahead. You’ll have to be a day ahead, right? So a new believer can disciple a non believer in knowing the gospel, right? New believer, I’d someone to just begin with believer. She sounds like you don’t have to be one step ahead. Yes. Right. A newer believer can disciple a new believer, right? That’s the idea. So I started to see this happen in Houston where these conversations started to be replicated, you know, and these guys were starting to make disciples. We were meeting together for, you know, we would meet together 12 times or so. And at every week, and then the ask in the middle of that was, can you have these conversations with somebody else? And this is what started to happen. So, you know, I mean, right now I’ve got about 600 people in one on one discipleship, you know, where I’m at in Houston. And we just added another 140 in the last two months, but it’s all been with this whole idea of having discipleship conversation. So when we say, what is discipleship, we’re saying that disciplsehip is one Jesus follower leading another person to follow Jesus. Oh, yeah. Right. It’s one Jesus follower. Leading another person to follow Jesus more closely. That is the essence of discipleship. It’s not knowledge base, right? So what I’m doing is this is not knowledge based, it’s obedience based, right? So when we’re training people how to disciple, we’re just saying like if you’re following Jesus and you’re being obedient, that’s the place from which we disciple. If it’s knowledge and not everyone could do it, because not everyone has the same knowledge of scripture. If it’s obedience, if you’re disciplined from the fact that, hey, I’m following Jesus and I’m being obedient as I can. If I fail, I’m going to admit it and I struggle. I’m going to admit it to the guy and discipling. And I’m going to get up. I’m going to move forward. If you’re just sampling out of obedience, then you can start today. So I wanted to be more about obedience based discipleship and less about how much do I know. I’ve got to get prepared. I got to read a bunch of books. I got to study for three hours. That’s not what was happening. The New Testament. Nobody had that luxury of not everybody get unroll scrolls and they just had to tell stories. And they put their belief in Jesus because of what they heard. And as a result, disciples were made. So my whole premise here in Houston was to say, what would happen if we could get back to what they did in the first century New Testament church? What if we just did that? What if we just reduced and refined everything until we could get back to that point where people were having gospel having to establish a conversations and those conversations were being repeated and then lives were replicating that. With other people. We were just making disciples who made disciples. So it blew my author construct and, you know, my teacher construct pushed all the parameters of that out for me because I had to go, okay, what would that look like? So and this is what I’m most excited about. And what that would look like was that you’d have to you had to know you’d have to understanding of what you’re doing in each conversation. Right. And then you just have to know you’d have to have a verse in a place to start.

So what I did when we talked about, we talked all morning about the art of brevity and communication. I just applied those same principles and discipleship and I was like, okay, let’s make it as simple as we possibly can. So what I did was I basically, this is some of your readers can see this card right here. But this represents three months of discipleship. Okay. That’s three months of discipleship. So on one side is the process. So what we’re teaching people is they’re going to get together and they’re going to read scripture. They’re going to ask these questions about scripture and then they’re going to they’re going to apply it in their daily life. And then they’re going to pray it through. That’s all right. So every discipleshipmeeting has those rhythms to it. We’re going to take a passage. We’re going to read it out of multiple translations, we’re going to ask the same questions every week. Of different texts. We’re going to develop the strategy based on what we sense God’s telling us to do and that we’re going to pray about it. And so that people couldn’t get lost on the back of it. There’s a prayer rhythm. So this is the way that we teach people how to pray in a discipleship setting, right? So this is a rhythm. It’s not a formula and what people freak out and goes, but there’s not a formula that’s right. But there is a rhythm to it. There is a rhythm. And so I wanted something to be portable that you could like, you could put it in your pocket, you could pull it out, just coffee, and you could open up your Bible. And you this is your disciplemaker’s guide, right? We call it the disciple maker’s guide. Okay. And so that was the first iteration, the second integration was what I did was, you know, if we say making disciples is the goal. Any church in the world would say, we believe that. Jesus told us to go make disciples. Everyone, everyone virtually everybody agrees with this in church that we should make disciples. But yet a lot of times, we don’t, we don’t study subjects that are about discipleship, if we study something completely different. And so what I did was I said, okay. What would be the marks of a disciple? We’d say, well, disciples someone who is assured of their Salvation. Like, they know they’ve given their life to Christ. They know their identity and Jesus. They know what it means to be a son or a daughter of the lord. Yes. They have yielded their life to the leadership of the Holy Spirit that they’re learning how to be led by the Holy Spirit. They know how to fight spiritual battles. They know how to do spiritual warfare. When temptation comes when trials come, they know how to they know how to fight their way through that. They know what it means to practice generosity, right? A disciple someone who lives generously. Whatever God gives them, they give it, they give it away in terms of knowledge or time and talent and treasure, all the things that we think about giving, right? And the disciple is someone who grows. A disciple of someone who never stops being a disciple that they always grow in their understanding of what it means to live in community and what it means to be to make other disciples. So what I did then is I took that and I developed this, this is a, this is, once again, represents this is three months of curriculum. So I eliminated the books. Okay. And I got it down into this. So. Here are the 6 characteristics of a disciple. So I said if these things are important, then that’s what we should be talking about, right? So we have the 6 characteristics of a disciple and then we’ve got scriptures that go with each one. And then here’s the card. This card right here. Here’s the card printed on the thing. So you have, here’s your first characteristic, someone who’s assured of their Salvation. And then I have next to it, this statement, my Salvation is based on what Christ did for me. And then you’ve got four verses that you would read together. So you’d pick a verse and you’d just read one verse when you meet together, then you’d read the other verse on your own. And you’d come back and meet together next week and re diverse. So you’ve got. Powerful. So it’s been very easy. I’m trying to think of the right way to do that. It’s creative and so the cool thing about this is that the reason why I wanted to talk about it on your show today is that I’ve been going to churches and teaching them how to do this process. Okay. And then what I do with this tweet, so we would come in and spend a weekend I would teach through it and teach the whole process. We would do part of it would be a lab where people tried out with each other. And so what I believe is every person has to find their discipleship voice. You know, teaching has a voice, you know, preaching has the voice when you’re preaching you get a preacher voice.

You got a teaching voice, but there’s also an discipleship voice. So what I do with churches is I teach the framework, I teach the power of friendship, you’re harnessing friendships that you already have in existence to say, hey, would you be willing to get together? And let’s read what Jesus has to say about being a fully devoted disciple, which you would be able to meet together once a week and we’ll just read together. So we harness the power of friendship. We use the framework, and then we fine tune it. In other words, on a weekend, I help people to find their discipleship voice and to actually do this with one of their friends to try it out as a lab. Okay. And then the cool thing is with this piece, I can have it I can print it in any form to put the church’s logo on it, so it becomes theirs. It doesn’t have it doesn’t have anything about my church on it or. Okay. My ministry, we custom print those pieces for every church. So I know that’s fast, and I’m not sure how much time we have left.

Dwayne

Well, I want to hear more about that. We might want to get you back on because we are about out of time today, but do they go to your website to find out about that?

Dave

Yeah, they can bring you into the church. How do they schedule you? They just go to my website and there’s a little tab on there. I’ll scheduling and they can just put a note to say, tell me that they heard me on your show. They’re interested in doing a discipleship weekend. So I want to find a way to publish, put this on our blog as well. So people know about this and push them over to Dave’s side. This is a powerful thing. Dave, thank you for introducing this Tuesday, man.

Dave

Absolutely.

Dwayne

I’ve never seen it like this before. It’s really amazing. Hey, I’m excited. I’ve just tried to imagine how we can make this discipleship simple and conversational. And where it can happen in the context of friendships. Well, you’ve done it. And I’m not sure that I’ve ever seen this done before.

Dwayne

I’m intrigued for my own stuff. I’m saying they’re going, I could use that for my because I love mentoring and disciplining people. And I mean, we all should be doing it. Dave, you are like this deep well I was talking about, but unfortunately, we don’t have time today to draw it all out of you. That’s okay, man. So our prayers, happy back to conference soon. Okay. Is to certainly highlight these things you’ve got going on, you know, we’re big fans. I’ll be honest.

Dave

Hey man, I appreciate it, man. I’m honored. I wanted to get to be a part of what you’re doing. And God’s using you all around the globe, man. So he’s using incredible ways.

Dwayne

Well, I’m grateful, but I think partnerships is a deep part of that because we want to reinvent a wheel that’s already round and look so pretty. And you’ve done a really pretty round wheel there that I don’t need to reinvent. We just need to let people know what you’re doing.

Dave

That’s how I feel. So that’s great. I am honored. I want God to use it, and I’m praying that there’ll be a discipleship movement around our globe, you know, that people will just start making disciples. And it can’t be stopped. It’s the one thing that you don’t need a building to do.

Dwayne

Well, thank you all for watching. I realize we have people watching in parts of Asia. This is broadcast to Satellite television across Asia, which is awesome. So I bet you can go on to his website, maybe even found some of these materials and he felt they’re all there. Okay, so they can. They don’t have to have a hard copy necessarily.

Dae

That’s right. Okay.

Dwayne

And maybe even an Amazon.com or whatever. I bet you can find this materials out there.

Dave

Yeah, then the books are on Kindle and they’re digital forms of them and if you punch in my name, all of them will come up, like all the ones I’ve written and they’re all there. Yeah. Sounds good.

Dwayne

Well, thanks for joining us today. We appreciate you man.

Dave

Great, hey, thank you so much, my friend.

Dwayne

All right, thanks everybody for joining us for live talk today. We’ll be back next week. Thanks again. Blessings on you.

Announcer

This is live talk with Dwayne Moore. We’re talking worship on a global scale.

Dwayne

Thank you everyone for joining us. We love being with you each week. We appreciate you watching or listening to the podcast. We have more special guests lined up for the next several weeks that you’re just going to love. So excited to bring these guests to you this information, this inspiration to you and please reach out to us at office@nextlevelworship.com and let us know you are listening. Let us hear from you and you can go to our Facebook page at next level worship international and just send us a message and let us know you’re listening and send us a question if you want us to respond to something or answer a question for you. However we can help you give a prayer request we can pray with you about. We would love to do that. Thank you so much. We’ll be back with you next week. We’ll see you then.

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